MAF (Mass Air Flow Sensor) Problems

[awschubert]

I recently replaced my Mass Air Flow Sensor (MAF) from AutoZone. I got a Remanufactured Bosch Cardone Reman/Mass Air Flow Sensor.

My problem is when I drive, if I have to come to a stop or press the clutch or shift to netural the rpm's drop well below 1000 for a second, then come back up to about 8500-9000RPM's and on random occasions my beetle will stall.

I disconnected the MAF and it ran great but the ESP and EPC lights came on and it was a bit sluggish on hard acceleration so Im assuming that my beetle went into "limp" mode. I plugged the MAF back in and the lights turned off but again with the stalling and idle drop.

After my little trouble shoot I have determined that it has to be the MAF. I am wondering if anyone can recommend if I should just put out for the new MAF, if anyone has had issues with this particular brand or if there is a different recommended brand MAF?

Any and all help will be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!

[esse10]

I think the computer needs to re-calculate the new maf sensor. You need to reset the computer by unplugging the battery plus cable leave off for a while ie 10 minutes , plug back in. The car will drve different after that untill the computer sets up it's new peramiters for the new maf sensor. Mine did the same thing when I cleaned the maf and throttle body and replaced different plugs. I just ran it a few days like that untill it came back to normal. Good luck man.

[awschubert]

I ended up getting a new Bosch MAF from BAP Auto, my car doesnt die when I push the clutch or come to a quick stop, but now it seems to shutter when I accelerate on occasion. I also replaced my plugs cuz they looked kinda bad and I wanted to do it since I bought the car cuz who knows when the last owner changed them. Anywho, When accelerating to get to highway speeds it shutters and seems like its missing, and sometimes the check engine light will flash but then turn off. I dont know what it could be. I even checked all of the plugs to make sure they were all ok and they all looked just fine.. Any other ideas?

[awschubert]

Originally Posted by esse10

I think the computer needs to re-calculate the new maf sensor. You need to reset the computer by unplugging the battery plus cable leave off for a while ie 10 minutes , plug back in. The car will drve different after that untill the computer sets up it's new peramiters for the new maf sensor. Mine did the same thing when I cleaned the maf and throttle body and replaced different plugs. I just ran it a few days like that untill it came back to normal. Good luck man.

So do you think that would cause the car to shutter when accelerating and make the CEL flash then turn off after a second? The car stops shuttering after it gets up to speed or I let off the accelerator.

[Smileybug]

My guess with the misfires would be coil packs.

[IndyTom]

Originally Posted by awschubert

I ended up getting a new Bosch MAF from BAP Auto, my car doesnt die when I push the clutch or come to a quick stop, but now it seems to shutter when I accelerate on occasion. I also replaced my plugs cuz they looked kinda bad and I wanted to do it since I bought the car cuz who knows when the last owner changed them. Anywho, When accelerating to get to highway speeds it shutters and seems like its missing, and sometimes the check engine light will flash but then turn off. I dont know what it could be. I even checked all of the plugs to make sure they were all ok and they all looked just fine.. Any other ideas?

What type of spark plugs did you replace the old ones with? Did you check the gap before installing them? Did you make sure the coil packs were seated properly. I cleaned my coil packs and rubber sleaves and used a little Dialectric grease on the boots and the tip of the spark plug. Also make sure the Coil packs are bolted down and the plugs are seated securely. Since you changed the spark plugs they seem to be the first choice to check for proper heat range and gap.

[IndyTom]

My money is on the Spark Plugs. I bet you are running some Autolite or Motorcraft crappy plugs that just don't work.
VW's are picky about spark plugs especially the 1.8T engine. I would replace them with a set of OEM NGK's and I bet your troubles will be over.

Home Page > Search > PFR6Q > ES#592 Spark Plugs - Set Of Four (#PFR6Q) - PFR6Q4CYL

Here is a link of someone complaining about Misfires in his beetle. He replaced MAF and sparkplugs and hat multiple misfires until he
swapped out his Autolite plugs for the NGK's. Problem solved.

http://forums.subdriven.com/showthre...Beetle-Misfire

[awschubert]

Originally Posted by Smileybug

My guess with the misfires would be coil packs.

Took it to Autozone today and had them run the codes. I had the 2 current codes come up as active:
P0304 - Definition: Cylinder 4 misfier condition.
P0300 - Definition: Random Cylinder misfire Detected.

Then he said i had the current codes "pending":
P1225 - Definition: Injector circuit cylinder 1 short to ground
P1126 - Definition: Injector circuit cylinder 2 short to ground
P1127 - Definition: Injector cirucit cylinder 3 short to ground
P1128 - Definition: Injector circuit cylinder 4 short to ground
P1176 - Definition: Rear O2s correction limit obtained
P1137 - Definition: Long term fuel trim add. fuel B1 system too rich
P0102 - Definition: Mass or volume Air flow sensor curcuit low inpuit
P1245 - Definition: Tank ventilation valbe short to ground


-- One think I do not understand at all is that my car ran perfect until I changed the damned MAF and spark plugs.. now all this crap!!!! Im completely lost as to how this could all happen all at once randomly....

I also bought a new coil pack and replaced it in what I was told was cylinder 4. No dice, still misses when accellerating. also note that I did reset the computer by disconnecting the battery for 30 mins to ensure that it all cleared out of the computer to make sure that i was starting fresh.

I did purchase the same plugs that were in there Autolite Platinum.

Also the shuddering/misfire is felt under heavy acceleration, after shifting into second and third gear and letting off the clutch completely, if I bring the RPM's up high enough it wont miss or shudder...

[IndyTom]

Originally Posted by awschubert

.

I did purchase the same plugs that were in there Autolite Platinum.

Also the shuddering/misfire is felt under heavy acceleration, after shifting into second and third gear and letting off the clutch completely, if I bring the RPM's up high enough it wont miss or shudder...

I thought so. Autolite Platinums are about the worst spark plugs you can put in that beetle. I did the same thing. Went to Autozone and they didn't show any decent spark plugs for my beetle and talked me into the Autolite's I put those in and the car just didn't run right. Not anything as bad as your car acts but it was hesitating and my gas mileage went down by 3mpg. I took those things back and went to PeP Boys and got some NGK iridium plugs. Man what a difference! Car ran 100% better with those plugs. Of course you are getting all those random readings because once you get a misfire other items will fail and throw codes. Think about it. You didn't do anything but change your MAF and the spark plugs. The simplest explanation is that there is something not right with those sparkplugs. Did you at least gap the spark plugs to 0.032? Sometimes those Autolite spark plugs will have too large or too small of a gap and then you can get misfires as well. You already spend all this money for the right parts why not get the spark plugs your car is suppose to have?
Forget Autozone, they don't have the right kind of plugs for our cars. Also when you change the plugs check your connectors to the coils. They get old and break. Two of mine broke. If they are cracked or compromised in any way they also will cause improper connection to the coils and misfires. Make sure the wires are straight in them and that the connecter is not cracked or broken. You can get new plastic connectors from the dealer. They are a pain to replace since you need a special tool to get the wires out of the original connector and then they need to be put back into the new connector. Took me about 2 hours to swap out 2 connectors on mine. But lets not get ahead of ourselves. Swap out those crappy Autolite's and then see what happens.
PS: By any chance did you have any oil in your spark plug tubes?

[awschubert]

Originally Posted by IndyTom

But lets not get ahead of ourselves. Swap out those crappy Autolite's and then see what happens.
PS: By any chance did you have any oil in your spark plug tubes?

Thanks for the advise! I will just bite the bullet on them and toss them out for now, they only cost me about 6 bucks for the 4 plugs and I understand ya.. I just was going with what was in there.. I just ran out and pulled one plug out and checked the gap and it appears to be about .045ish. Yeah I did notice some oil around the plug tubes. Thought that was kinda weird but cleaned it up and that was it.

[Smileybug]

Here are the spark plugs you should be running. I'd personally go for the NGK's since they are OEM but they are on the expensive side. NGK or Bosch are all I would run in my car.

[IndyTom]

Originally Posted by awschubert

Thanks for the advise! I will just bite the bullet on them and toss them out for now, they only cost me about 6 bucks for the 4 plugs and I understand ya.. I just was going with what was in there.. I just ran out and pulled one plug out and checked the gap and it appears to be about .045ish. Yeah I did notice some oil around the plug tubes. Thought that was kinda weird but cleaned it up and that was it.

WOW, .045 is way too much. Regap your plugs to .032 and see what happens. If the gap is too wide it is very possible that the spark doesn't conduct properly and causes the misfire.
I would rather go with a little bit of a smaller gap then too wide of one. But the proper gap is 0.032. Perhaps that will take care of it? Give it a try. I would still get the other plugs but for now you already have the Autolites might as well regap and give it a try.
The oil in your sparkplug tubes comes from a leaky Valve cover gasket. The way the Valve cover gasket sits on the head is in two parts. The one that goes around the sides of the head and the center part that seals the spark plug tubes. My plug tubes were soaking with oil. So I ordered a Valve Cover gasket kit which included the 2 part gasket along with a half moon cam tensioner gasket and flat gasket. It was a bit tricky to replace but it did take care of any seaping oil in the spark plug tubes and oil that was dripping on the drivers side where the half moon gasket was resting in. It's about a 2 hour job if you take your time. If the oil in the tubes isn't too bad I wouldn't worry about it just yet. Just get the other issue figured out first and then go onto the next.
Good Luck!

[awschubert]

Originally Posted by IndyTom

WOW, .045 is way too much. Regap your plugs to .032 and see what happens. If the gap is too wide it is very possible that the spark doesn't conduct properly and causes the misfire.
I would rather go with a little bit of a smaller gap then too wide of one. But the proper gap is 0.032. Perhaps that will take care of it? Give it a try. I would still get the other plugs but for now you already have the Autolites might as well regap and give it a try.
The oil in your sparkplug tubes comes from a leaky Valve cover gasket. The way the Valve cover gasket sits on the head is in two parts. The one that goes around the sides of the head and the center part that seals the spark plug tubes. My plug tubes were soaking with oil. So I ordered a Valve Cover gasket kit which included the 2 part gasket along with a half moon cam tensioner gasket and flat gasket. It was a bit tricky to replace but it did take care of any seaping oil in the spark plug tubes and oil that was dripping on the drivers side where the half moon gasket was resting in. It's about a 2 hour job if you take your time. If the oil in the tubes isn't too bad I wouldn't worry about it just yet. Just get the other issue figured out first and then go onto the next.
Good Luck!

Awesome! this gives me hope! haha! The oil on the tubes seemed pretty minor, nothing running onto the plugs but some spots on the actual tubes about halfway between the rubber footing and the top of the coil. I will order the gasket kit and fix it but I wont freak over it yet. I will try regapping the plugs and see if that resolves my issue for now, I will definately get the recommended plugs tho, only because after what all of you guys are saying about getting the NGK plugs or Bosch. I would rather pay out a couple extra bucks for a higher quality plug and would def prefer the OEM plug over a cheapo. Im really getting tired of Autozone for sure cuz so far most of the things i have bought from them have caused issues as you guys can see so far LOL! Once i get the gap fixed on all the plugs I will let you know what happens from there..
I really appreciate all your help guys!

Im also running Premium Unleaded and im sure those plugs just dont fire hot enough for the higher octane gas would be another assumption.

[IndyTom]

Originally Posted by awschubert

Once i get the gap fixed on all the plugs I will let you know what happens from there..

Do it now. I am anxious to see if that solved your issue.

Autozone is okay for Oil and filters, etc. Other stuff I usually get online.
I am actually running these plugs in my Beetle and they seem to do very well and are not as expensive as the OEM type plugs. http://www.amazon.com/NGK-BKR6EIX-Ir...ar=1&carId=002

They are NGK IX Iridium plugs and Pep Boys does carry them in stock for $6.99 a piece. So far no issues with these plugs. Car purrs like a kitty Gets about 25mpg average and with 160k+ Miles on the clock still runs great. Caution with Iridium Plugs. Don't gap them. The center eletrode is super fine and thin and will break if you try and pry it open. Iridium plugs will conduct electricity better than Platinum or Copper so I left the gap at .028 with these plugs and they seem to be doing very well.

[IndyTom]

Originally Posted by awschubert

Im also running Premium Unleaded and im sure those plugs just dont fire hot enough for the higher octane gas would be another assumption.

I don't think that is the issue. The 1.8T actually requires running Premium Gas and the Autolite plugs should be the correct heat range for your application. Even if you put lower octane gas in the car the knock sensors and the ECM will automatically adjust the timing to prevent damage to the engine. Your performance will suffer but your car will be protected. That said I would only put in Premium 93 or 91 if that is all that is available in your area.

Another thing.... Did you replace all the vacuum lines to the correct positions? Did you check them for damage? Mine got hard and some of them just broke when I tried to pull them off.
I replaced all my vacuum lines with silicone hoses. They will last a lot longer and shouldn't wear out. Just a thought besides the spark plugs.

[awschubert]

Originally Posted by IndyTom

I don't think that is the issue. The 1.8T actually requires running Premium Gas and the Autolite plugs should be the correct heat range for your application. Even if you put lower octane gas in the car the knock sensors and the ECM will automatically adjust the timing to prevent damage to the engine. Your performance will suffer but your car will be protected. That said I would only put in Premium 93 or 91 if that is all that is available in your area.

Another thing.... Did you replace all the vacuum lines to the correct positions? Did you check them for damage? Mine got hard and some of them just broke when I tried to pull them off.
I replaced all my vacuum lines with silicone hoses. They will last a lot longer and shouldn't wear out. Just a thought besides the spark plugs.

We only have 91 here in Phoenix. I always try to run Premium and never run any less than Plus (89 octaine) I avoid using 87 at all costs only cuz I do know the 1.8T is recommended 91. As for the vaccum hoses Yes I did.. Took a picture so I can make sure I got everything back in place properly. I also about a month ago just replaced every vacuum hose under the hood cuz they were all frayed and very squishy, inspeced all the tubes from the breather to the engine and replaced one that had a crack as well.

Now with that out of the way.... The news you were waiting for... Success! I checked all of the plugs, I wrote them down cuz I figured I would share with you.. 2 plugs were gapped to
.045, 1 plug gapped to .055 and the last plug gapped to .060. I re-gapped them the recommended .032, got them all back in, took it for a spin down the surface streets as well as on the highway and my little beetle ran wonderfully!!!! I just corrected the gaps on all the plugs for the AutoLite Platinum Plugs, but just to play it safe as well as what everyone said I will go pick up the NGK Plugs from Pep-Boys tomorrow AM and swap them out... All I can say is from here on out, I will always check the gapping on my plugs before changing them again, and just pay the extra few bucks on some good plugs vs. just some cheapos..

[IndyTom]

Originally Posted by awschubert

We only have 91 here in Phoenix. I always try to run Premium and never run any less than Plus (89 octaine) I avoid using 87 at all costs only cuz I do know the 1.8T is recommended 91.

Now with that out of the way.... The news you were waiting for... Success! I checked all of the plugs, I wrote them down cuz I figured I would share with you.. 2 plugs were gapped to
.045, 1 plug gapped to .055 and the last plug gapped to .060. I re-gapped them the recommended .032, got them all back in, took it for a spin down the surface streets as well as on the highway and my little beetle ran wonderfully!!!! I just corrected the gaps on all the plugs for the AutoLite Platinum Plugs, but just to play it safe as well as what everyone said I will go pick up the NGK Plugs from Pep-Boys tomorrow AM and swap them out... All I can say is from here on out, I will always check the gapping on my plugs before changing them again, and just pay the extra few bucks on some good plugs vs. just some cheapos..

That's GREAT News!

Glad you got your car running again! WOW, with those kind of gaps I am surprised that your beetle was running at all.
Since it is running well now I wouldn't worry too much about getting different spark plugs. Just keep an eye on your gas mileage and see how she performs. Arizona must have Oxynated fuel or whatever they call it. Better for the environment but with less benefit to the actual car. 91 is all your car needs so I wouldn't worry about that. 89 will do in a pinch since the cars ECM will enrich fuel mixture and reduce timing if it gets a signal from the knock sensors. Your performance may suffer a little as well as your gas mileage but the car should be fine.

For now just enjoy your car and relax for a change.

[Smileybug]

I just realized I never posted the link to the plugs GermanAutoParts.com

If you can get NGKs locally, I'd run those.

[awschubert]

Originally Posted by IndyTom

WOW, with those kind of gaps I am surprised that your beetle was running at all.
Since it is running well now I wouldn't worry too much about getting different spark plugs. Just keep an eye on your gas mileage and see how she performs. Arizona must have Oxynated fuel or whatever they call it. Better for the environment but with less benefit to the actual car. 91 is all your car needs so I wouldn't worry about that. 89 will do in a pinch since the cars ECM will enrich fuel mixture and reduce timing if it gets a signal from the knock sensors. Your performance may suffer a little as well as your gas mileage but the car should be fine.

For now just enjoy your car and relax for a change.

Yeah it was just getting worse and worse as I drove, was about to the point where I'm sure it wouldnt have been running. Yeah we have Oxygenated fuel out here. I will definately enjoy it now.. I bought this car from someone about 6 months ago, and I have just been trying to get it running, after buying it I realized that it was a tad bit neglected espically since every vacuum hose needed replaced. They did an overhaul on the engine 30,000 miles ago and they also changed all the pumps and stuff on it, so I knew when these things started popping up it wasnt something too severe. Now that I have all the vacuum leaks fixed, new MAF, new plugs I think thats it, just about time for an oil change again and thats about it. I will order the valve cover gasket kit and replace but not gonna freak aobut that and wont worry aobut the plugs too much but I do want to change them out later on down the road. We all know I will be back again if I have any issues and if anything pops up I'll let you know.

[IndyTom]

Originally Posted by awschubert

Yeah it was just getting worse and worse as I drove, was about to the point where I'm sure it wouldnt have been running. Yeah we have Oxygenated fuel out here. I will definately enjoy it now.. I bought this car from someone about 6 months ago, and I have just been trying to get it running, after buying it I realized that it was a tad bit neglected espically since every vacuum hose needed replaced. They did an overhaul on the engine 30,000 miles ago and they also changed all the pumps and stuff on it, so I knew when these things started popping up it wasnt something too severe. Now that I have all the vacuum leaks fixed, new MAF, new plugs I think thats it, just about time for an oil change again and thats about it. I will order the valve cover gasket kit and replace but not gonna freak aobut that and wont worry aobut the plugs too much but I do want to change them out later on down the road. We all know I will be back again if I have any issues and if anything pops up I'll let you know.

I got my kit from Blauparts: Vw Beetle Valve Cover Gasket Kit - Vw Beetle Valve Cover Gaskets

Everything you need for under 22 bucks. I wouldn't even worry about the cam seals unless they are leaking. It's a pain to replace those. I just replaced the Valve Cover gasket, Spark Plug tube gasket, Half Moon Seal and flat gasket. In order to replace the Half Moon seal and flat gasket you need a Cam Chain tensioner tool which you can either rent at Blauparts or buy one.
But for now I would just be happy the car runs right for a change and wait until spring to replace the Valve cover gaskets.