Automatic Transmission

[steve1173]

Have a 2010 Red Rock, when I brought it in for its courtesy service I was told do not have to worry about transmission oil changes, yesterday got a letter from VW with a manual revision stating that the oil should be changed every 50,000 miles for 2009, 2010 & 2011 (no new beetle but was for any 2.5). Did they change the transmissions for 2009+ compared to prior to 2009.

[DZLBUG]

Any year 2.5 automatic VW, has the 6 speed 09G. It does require fluid changes every 50k.

You are seeing your first evidence now; dealers generally don't know $hit from shinola. The service managers are generally just salesman, and don't know anything except how to charge you way too much money and make you feel good about it. And the vast majority of the mechanics don't use half the brain they were given, and their sole purpose is to get the car in and out the door as fast as possible whether the job was done right or not. All the good mechanics generally can't stand to see the way dealerships treat customers and how they are forced to cut corners so they can "beat the book," so instead they leave and find employment elsewhere.

My advice, use extreme caution and pay careful attention when using the dealer for "courtesy" service and warranty work. Once out of warranty, avoid them like the plague and find a real mechanic.

Good luck.

[pstur1]

In case anyone is interested, I just had the transmission fluid changed a few days ago at the dealer on my 06 Beetle with the 6 speed automatic transmission. Unless you do it yourself (which is difficult to do without some way of measuring the temperature of the fluid), I think the dealer is your only alternative. I paid approximately $150 for the service, in case anyone is wondering about the cost.

[joemac]

Got quote from VW dealer in Mckinney, TX on fluid change. $450.00 what goes here? Why so much difference.

Joemac

[Tico4Life]

Originally Posted by pstur1

In case anyone is interested, I just had the transmission fluid changed a few days ago at the dealer on my 06 Beetle with the 6 speed automatic transmission. Unless you do it yourself (which is difficult to do without some way of measuring the temperature of the fluid), I think the dealer is your only alternative. I paid approximately $150 for the service, in case anyone is wondering about the cost.

Please excuse my ignorance but why exactly is the ATF temperature important when you service your automatic transmission? You are not baking a cake or anything like that.

Be careful what you believe from your dealership, they always have "special" dealer recommended fluids that in some cases are more than twice as much as the best brand, just because they have a fancy label with a vw logo on it. Just an FYI, vw does not manufacture ATF or any type of fluids for engine or transmission.

Servicing an AT can get messy so $150 is not bad but make sure they are changing the filter as well, if not then run away Rene. $450 sounds more like it for a transmission service at a dealership. All it takes is drain the ATF, remove pan, replace old filter with a new one, replace pan gasket if applies, put pan back in place and replenish ATF.
Another advice is beware of the shop who offers an AT service with power flush for that will brake your transmission in no time at all. By doing that they are forcing all the ATF that is in the ducts, cooler and torque converter and as they are doing that they are also forcing metal shavings thru the system including but not limited to the valve body which happens to be a very sensitive part in your tranny.
Some ppl opose this theory but I have seen it happen, the newer electronic transmission are more prone to this type of damage. Same as not changing the filter, a clogged filter is certain death for an AT.

[pstur1]

Originally Posted by J.Arce

Please excuse my ignorance but why exactly is the ATF temperature important when you service your automatic transmission? You are not baking a cake or anything like that.

Be careful what you believe from your dealership, they always have "special" dealer recommended fluids that in some cases are more than twice as much as the best brand, just because they have a fancy label with a vw logo on it. Just an FYI, vw does not manufacture ATF or any type of fluids for engine or transmission.

Servicing an AT can get messy so $150 is not bad but make sure they are changing the filter as well, if not then run away Rene. $450 sounds more like it for a transmission service at a dealership. All it takes is drain the ATF, remove pan, replace old filter with a new one, replace pan gasket if applies, put pan back in place and replenish ATF.
Another advice is beware of the shop who offers an AT service with power flush for that will brake your transmission in no time at all. By doing that they are forcing all the ATF that is in the ducts, cooler and torque converter and as they are doing that they are also forcing metal shavings thru the system including but not limited to the valve body which happens to be a very sensitive part in your tranny.
Some ppl opose this theory but I have seen it happen, the newer electronic transmission are more prone to this type of damage. Same as not changing the filter, a clogged filter is certain death for an AT.

The reason that you need some way to accurately measure the temperature of the transmission fluid is that the volume of the fluid changes with temperature. The six speed transmission with tiptronic does not have a dipstick to check the fluid level. Instead, there is a “standpipe” that is built into the transmission that serves as a dipstick. When the fluid gets to a specific temperature, transmission fluid starts to poor out of the standpipe, which indicates that the transmission has the correct amount of fluid.

I would agree that $450 is very high to change the transmission fluid. I would suggest looking elsewhere or investigating what you get for that price.

pstur1

[joemac]

I have now been and or contacted 3 different transmission shops. No shop I contacted will touch the Tiptronic transmission fluid change. Two of the three at first said sure no problem. They checked a little deeper into it after I explained that it takes a special fluid etc. They after checking changed their minds and would not even consider it. Mine is a 2.5 NBC and is not a DSG. The dealer informed me of this while changing a bad seat belt buckle. He also told me not to worry about it until it reaches 60-70k. Looks like I have no option but to trust the dealer for this service.

Joemac

[Judee]

I have a 2008, and have not received any letter from VW... however I think I have the same transmission as every other 2.5L, right?

Nubz just recently rolled over 50k, so I called the dealership to get a quote and they gave me the same "It's a sealed transmission so Corporate tells us we don't need to change the fluid". He then followed up with a $450 price.

Is this something that you can do yourself? I assume heating the fluid is to account for fluid expansion, so isn't there a nice easy chart somewhere that provides an expansion curve for this fluid?

For example 1 qt of this stuff at 60 degrees is the same amount of fluid as 1.1 qt of this magical fluid at 100 degrees?
.

[MyOtherRidesAVette]

Originally Posted by Judee

I have a 2008, and have not received any letter from VW... however I think I have the same transmission as every other 2.5L, right?

Nubz just recently rolled over 50k, so I called the dealership to get a quote and they gave me the same "It's a sealed transmission so Corporate tells us we don't need to change the fluid". He then followed up with a $450 price.

Is this something that you can do yourself? I assume heating the fluid is to account for fluid expansion, so isn't there a nice easy chart somewhere that provides an expansion curve for this fluid?

For example 1 qt of this stuff at 60 degrees is the same amount of fluid as 1.1 qt of this magical fluid at 100 degrees?
.

Per the OPs post, his letter applied starting with '09, so you would not have received a letter. As the 2.5 started in '06, apparently there was a change to the trannies in '09. Possibly contrary to DZLBUGs post. They can make changes without changing model numbers, what changes is the p/n. Best I can tell you. And if there was a Manual update sent out to Owners by VW, they, at the same time, probably before, sent a Service Bulletin to the Dealerships, and authorized service centers.

MORAV

[pstur1]

Originally Posted by Judee

I have a 2008, and have not received any letter from VW... however I think I have the same transmission as every other 2.5L, right?

Nubz just recently rolled over 50k, so I called the dealership to get a quote and they gave me the same "It's a sealed transmission so Corporate tells us we don't need to change the fluid". He then followed up with a $450 price.

Is this something that you can do yourself? I assume heating the fluid is to account for fluid expansion, so isn't there a nice easy chart somewhere that provides an expansion curve for this fluid?

For example 1 qt of this stuff at 60 degrees is the same amount of fluid as 1.1 qt of this magical fluid at 100 degrees?
.

It is probably possible to do this yourself, but rather difficult, especially if you have the six speed automatic transmission produced by Aisin. My other car is a Mini Cooper S with the same transmission, so I look at another forum occasionally.

Here is a link to a forum that discusses changing the transmission fluid on a Mini Cooper S:

MINI COOPER :: North American Motoring - MCSA Tranny Fluid Change

The procedure to change the fluid on a VW would obviously be a little different, primarily in terms of what parts need to be taken off the engine in order to access the “factory fill hole.”

Also, to check the temperature of the fluid, other threads on this site discuss the use of a VagCom, which apparently is a software program that interfaces with the car’s sensors to read the temperature of the transmission fluid. So, you would need to investigate that as well.

There is also a thread on this site written by MarvinsDad (I believe) that discusses how to change the fluid on an older model VW. This might be helpful as well.

I guess the bottom line is that this would be rather difficult and somewhat expensive to do, especially if you have to purchase a VagCom. If someone has done the fluid change on a VW with the six speed automatic with tiptronic, I would be interested in hearing about your experience.

As a side note, do the people that have been quoted $450 to have the fluid changed have the six speed automatic with tiptronic transmission? I am just curious as to why there is such a difference in price, as I only paid $150 to have mine changed at the dealer a few months ago.

[Judee]

Yup... 6-Speed Tiptronic.

I'm just really skeptical about the whole "lifetime" claim on any lubricant.

[joemac]

I have worked on cars and my motorcycles most of my life. (70) If I can't get 3 other shops, and one of them major to touch it. I just don't think I want to chance ruining the transmission. I can't afford it either. I can scrape up the $450.00 over a couple of months, and would really feel better about the whole thing.I am 3-4k from 50k so plenty of time since the service manager said not to change it until 60-70k. I am going to have it done at 50k just for piece of mind.

Joemac

[pstur1]

Originally Posted by joemac

I have worked on cars and my motorcycles most of my life. (70) If I can't get 3 other shops, and one of them major to touch it. I just don't think I want to chance ruining the transmission. I can't afford it either. I can scrape up the $450.00 over a couple of months, and would really feel better about the whole thing.I am 3-4k from 50k so plenty of time since the service manager said not to change it until 60-70k. I am going to have it done at 50k just for piece of mind.

Joemac

Joemac, (this might be helpful to others as well)

I have a subscription to ALLDATA for my car, which is what independent repair shops use to make estimates on repairing vehicles. I see from your signature that you have an 06 convertible, which is the same car that I have.

I looked up the labor time to have the transmission fluid changed, and it was .5 to .8 hours. If you assume a labor rate of $100/hour, plus the cost of the fluid, that would be pretty close to the $150 that I paid to have the fluid changed a couple of months ago. That is a far cry from the $450 that your dealer quoted you!

Also, ALLDATA and my owners manual specify a 40,000 mile interval for the fluid change, so I don’t think pushing that to 60-70,000 miles would be a good idea, as your dealer suggested.

I think this would be worth a call to your dealer to clarify what exactly they are doing for $450. Also, if there is another VW dealer nearby, you might give them a call to see if their quote is significantly different.

Good luck with your fluid change, let us know how it turns out.

pstur1