The Phaeton's Dead... Long Live the Phaeton

[ASurroca]

I'm sure by now everyone who keeps track of Volkswagen news knows that the Phaeton will be dropped from the US market. Call me a "fanboy" if you will, but I firmly believe its failure in the US market was due in large part to the depreciation of the US dollar versus the euro (weren't it for this, Volkswagen could have sold the Phaeton for some $15k less, making it a bargain).

So, anyhow, the topic of a second-gen Phaeton has been popping up here and there on other forums. Some folks think this "CLS killer" might in fact be the second-gen Phaeton, but I'm not so sure. That model is going to be built at the Emden plant and IIRC will be built off the Passat's chassis; and I don't see why they would move the second-gen Phaeton's production away from the Glass Factory after all that hulaballo.

At any rate, it appears that the bosses at Volkswagen realized that having two executive luxury sedans is stupid, especially when the Audi A8L is so much better at what it does (and better-selling) than the Phaeton. I do think that the low-key styling of the Phaeton was a "miss" on the market, since it hit market precisely at a moment when consumers were screaming for in-your-face styling. So, VW is going back to the drawing board, and by that I mean the original Concept D1. In other words, like the Concept D1, the next Phaeton is expected to be a 5-door fastback. In other words, it will be substantially different from the Audi A8L.

Here's the latest rendering out there, from Road&Track:

http://static.flickr.com/20/71693085_3ef37d4cd7_o.jpg

I'd have to say, it's probably pretty close to the real deal. After all, it basically looks like a gigantic Passat turned hatchback. And I'm digging it.

[Deserion]

I'd hit it. ;)

-Des

[dnyed]

I'd hit a Passat, before I'd hit that..... :(

[jdesigns]

:hitit: :banana:



:goodjob: :bigthumb:

I love it! :thup:

[PhoenixRising]

Ah, too bad. It was a Super Expensive Keen Car, at least I thought so.

[mentalVdub]

that's mad cool, but i could never fathom spending at least 60k on a VW.

[Fowvay]

THAT'S H-O-T HOT HOT HOT!!!! :eek:

[Mortville]

Looks rediculous to me.

[kcfoxie]

that's mad cool, but i could never fathom spending at least 60k on a VW.
I like it. If I had the ability to friviously spend money on such luxury, I'd certainly demand it in hatchback form. Sedans are sooo 1990s! :P

[TommyK8]

Volkswagen has a lot more things to worry about than the Phaeton. I'm sorry, but it's failure in the U.S. is due to a complete inability by Volkswagen to understand the American car market. There are only a very few people in this country that are willing to spend $80,000+ on a Volkswagen. The foundation of VW in this country is the air-cooled Beetle, and that evolved into a perception of this brand as making a mostly economical, reliable car, with a unique look and feel. It doesn't include a luxury automobile at prices that when fully loaded approached $100K. In order to Volkswagen to be successful, they have to go back to their roots, improve on quality issues, and continue to develop unique, economical, good looking, and fun cars.

[ASurroca]

We'll see what comes out of the so-called "moonraker" project, but 1) VWoA appears to be finally turning an ear to the enthusiast/tuner crowd, and 2) they've said something about a US-only sub-Golf vehicle. I think while focusing on core offerings and enthusiast-friendly stuff, Volkswagen should wait until after the "CLS fighter" has hit market before thinking about bringing a second-gen Phaeton to the US.

[Phormula]

It was expected. The Phaeton was the Volkswagen nobody asked for. It was the dream of former president. Dr. Piech wanted to show that Volkswagen was able to build a luxury car and he went ahead in spite of all suggestion to market it either as an Audi, a Bentley or even to resurrect the Horch brand. The point is simple, in spite of Piech's dreams, people who sign checks for those cars do not want to buy only a piece of technology and quality, they want to see the "right" emblem on the steering wheel. It took 25 years to Audi to move from a popular car manufacturer to a sound alternative (here in Europe) to Mercedes and BMW. Hoping to do the same step with a single model was asking too much. Definitely.
Now the point is. what are they going to do with the Dresden factory? The "glass factory" was build around the Phaeton. Converting it to a more popular model won't be easy.

[kcfoxie]

No, conversions are never easy. This falls right in line with VW being a bit out of touch with itself (as evidant in US marketing and worldwide sales of certain models), but that's OK. I buy VW because I'm not all together myself, why should the car company be? :)

I want a Phaeton. I saw five of them in my city around the time of it's release, all tagged and being driven. I talked to one owner, a vet VW owner, who adored it and said it was everything the Bugatti they never wanted had!

Now, I think VW CAN make the Glass Factory work on another model rather easily, I mean they did convert (or add on?) to Puebla to make New Beetles and Jettas along side the aircooled cars, which I am sure share little more than a name in the manufacturing process.

[Byros]

I really like the older Phaeton, but it's price is waaaaaay too much for a Volkswagen,
add to that the quality issues with the MK IV cars, and poor customer service at the VW stealerships.

There's no way i'm shelling out 80K+ for a Volkwagen when that money could buy me a BMW, Audi or Mercedes.

As for the new Phaeton, I find it just awful......

[vw_beetle_gpx]

BOOOOOOOO


sorry, for that cash, its BMW all the way man

[kcfoxie]

BOOOOOOOO


sorry, for that cash, its BMW all the way man
Wasn't this car partially hand built? Does the BMW sport the same?

[Deserion]

Photothread of Phaeton assembly at the Glass Factory in Dresden.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=1837641

-Des

[squeebug]

wow awsome pictures!

[Knox]

I always wondered what VW was thinking bringing a $60K car to the states, home of the label hungry American. It was hard to imagine VW convincing buyers to purchase a car with the same logo that adorns the Beetle, it just wasn't meant to be (no offense to the Beetle owners).

[beetlejuice]

Too bad. I think this was partly a marketing problem. They should have made the Phaeton a separate marque and left off the VW badges for all the reasons listed above. Will these cars become instant collectables?
juice

[Oyveychris]

From what I've read, VW Dealerships didn't quite understand how to properly service these cars which did a great deal of damage to the idea of a reliable uber cruiser like the Phaeton.

Perhaps VW would have done better by resurrecting a defunct brand name, much like Mercedes did with Maybach. They needed to have a delineation between "the people's car" and a vehicle such as the Phaeton.

[oneighturbo]

spotted me one in Seoul

http://static.flickr.com/31/88536816_f4c086e961.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/oneighturbo/88536816/)

[Whitacre]

i LOVE the Phateon. I want my mom to continue her work that she loves, and then talking her into getting one. They are amazing cars, and its a shame that America didnt really give them a try. At least Europe still likes them...but they have always been smarter with cars than we have...especially on taste.

[Alan From NYC]

The Phaeton isn't dead. VW decided that since US buyers aren't ready to accept the idea of a $75000 Volkswagen (read, "incredibly poor sales"), it will no longer be imported.

Kind of a shame, though. It's a pretty nice car.

[scarabY2k]

that's mad cool, but i could never fathom spending at least 60k on a VW.

You've hit the nail on the head baby gurrl!! I think that's where the real problem lies. It's an awesome car though. I had the fortune to check one out at last years car show in Jacksonville. A quality car indeed.

We as VW owners are different cats and I don't think they're many folks outside our collective (USA-wise) who'll shell out that type of money on a VW.

[pdoel]

Unfortunately, I think there are a lot of manufacturers who aren't listening to what the people want.

Follow any of these message boards and you'll know that people have been BEGGING VW to bring over their smaller cars. Lupo, Polo, whatever. We get the Mini which has been a great success, but VW won't listen.

Instead, we get the Touareg (nice, but quite a few quality problems, expensive, and small for the price). The Phaeton (everyone's already commented ont he problems there). And now, a much bigger Jetta and bigger Passat. Where are the small cars that made VW famous? Where are the small cars the American people have been asking for?

In addition, the company that boasted "Drivers wanted" is now doing away with manuals. Something many "drivers" wanted. It's getting harder and harder to find cars now with manuals. I thought VW would never have this problem, but alas, I was wrong.

But, VW is not alone. This is happening across the board. While I like SUVs, I can't deny the fact that they are just getting bigger and bigger and bigger. I just saw a commercial for the new Rav4 last night. Now, it looks great, but I saw that it's now available with 3rd row seating. Why is that necessary? If you want a "cute ute", chances are, you don't need 3 rows of seating. If you do, get something bigger!

Ugh!

[scarabY2k]

Podel,

You've said a mouthful. I think Chrysler is the anthesis of what you've just stated. It seems as if they're making cars that people want. Chevy is now in the toilet due to their "made from the same mold" '06 models. They're so amorphous. Another cool thing about chrysler is that their models go from concept to showroom relatively quickly. The new Camaro looks like its a done deal but they're dropping the ball on getting it to the showroom. Just like they did with the HHR. Nice ride but the PT Cruiser carved a big notch in that niche. GM-wise, it looks like Pontiac now posseses all the cool points in the style category.

With the decline in the US auto market, VW better take heed to the signs, and give the people what they want.

[CyberGypsy]

that's mad cool, but i could never fathom spending at least 60k on a VW.
Thats like saying you would spend 50K on a kia...LOL

[scarabY2k]

Hey CyberGypsy,

If you're driving around in Ocala and see a Heritage Paper truck blowing it's horn at you, it's just me. I drive down that way on Wednesdays. See ya around.

[hoonbug]

We'll see what comes out of the so-called "moonraker" project, but 1) VWoA appears to be finally turning an ear to the enthusiast/tuner crowd, and 2) they've said something about a US-only sub-Golf vehicle. I think while focusing on core offerings and enthusiast-friendly stuff, Volkswagen should wait until after the "CLS fighter" has hit market before thinking about bringing a second-gen Phaeton to the US.

"US only sub-Golf" = Polo with a boot (=sedan). Polos with boots have been sold before in Brazil, China and Australia, but they have really sold miserably with the exception of China as sedans are rapidly declining in marketshare and are almost completely absent in the lower end market. Hopefully, sedan mad US folks will make it a success.

The new Polo GTI hatch is awesome. I wish it was going on sale in the US - it's got the 110 kW 1.8t stuffed in a car which weighs just over 1100 kgs.

I personally find it amusing that VW thinks they can charge so much for the Touareg as well, particularly the V10 TDI model (it's $130k here), but they seem to be getting away with it. Sedans have little future in almost all markets but the US, so maybe the SUV would have been a better choice for a Phaeton model rather than a slab sided boring super-Camry.

Saying that, the fast back in the pics above is hot. Reminds me of the Citroen C6. I'd have one if I won the lottery... but as I don't enter the lottery, it'll be a dream for a while longer.

thanks,
Andrew

[Tommy]

I'd hit myself for buying that :mad:

[mezonesxbox]

I dont think the VW logo has anything to do. To me it represents quality(maybe) and a rich history. The VW logo is actually really cool, way better than boring ford, or chevrolet or boring jaguar. The problem with the pha... this car is that it was too expensive. They should have made it at a deal price.

[Ollie]

Hmm..I think I liked the Phaeton better in its cancelled in'car'nation...
I picked up a copy of the Concept D brochure in Germany several years ago. Maybe it was the black paint on the car in the pictures, but I really loved the design. I stil llike it waaaay better than all the New Golf/Jetta/Corrado/Scirocco or Touareg bunch- a true original for the first time in many years. This attempt to get back to that plan leaves a lot to be desired for me.:( Just not as direct and clean as the D. I have a tendency to like very concretely outlined images- like Tin Tin comics or the advertising art of the 1930's, etc. Everything is tied together neatly and the solid blocks of color and texture just come together in my eye. Maybe I'm living in a cartoon fantasy- but the new Phaeton is a bit wishy-washy.

[PunkinBug]

Sorry - I adore the Phaeton and would prefer it over a BMW. And I adore BMW's. But I super, super like that Phaeton and in person, man, they are smokin.... I loveem. If I had the cash, and had the options, I would order one.

[Paldi]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v203/Paldi/My%20Phaeton/DSC00083c.jpg
The car just needed big wheels to make me a happy owner!