No More New Beetles ? [Archive] - NewBeetle.org Forums

kcfoxie

03-01-2006, 02:07 PM

Porsche is or has confirmed the additional 20% purchase in the company (they already had 18% I believe). This is so they can control VW and prevent it from destroying itself. In the MkV especially, VW cannot be distinguished from Audi. They need to be cheaper, less frills, and more dependable. People's car they are, if you're a paralegal with the matching slary. I can say that with a straight face because I watched my partner sign for a Jetta that the base price was $4k more than he makes in a year -- yet he's the exact age demographic they want. People's car... yah right.

/ rant off

The beetle needs to die. End of story. If the hardtop does not go away in 2008, I'm going to be a bit irritated. 10 years is a good run for the hard top model, I also see it as being the last to become a hybrid if at all. The convertible is a killer classic, strong sales, and the only cloth-top sold worldwide I believe. I see he convertible having a good 15 year run at minimum, and the Eos hard top convertible will compliment it with the "more refined" driver who needs room for 4 adults with luggage (something the convertible cannot do).

Also, once the beetle isn't made... all these yuppie girls will stop driving them. Not that I'm a woman hater, I'm just tired of waving and getting the bird... or stopping and asking them about a decal/spoiler/set of rims and being told at the pump to "go away you freak" or "I don't know we bought it like this."

I came from the aircooled roots, you saw an aircooled beetle driver you two spoke. It was understood. I get more respect from the vintage drivers than I do anyone else on the road, and that makes me cry. I passed a techo blue on my way to work. Pacing her in traffic I waved, kept looking at her. She glanced once and did tunel vision on me. How rude! Thank goodness the orange/black 'vert i see at lunch passed and waved at me to make up for it.

I know it seems a little unrealastic and idealist, but I do believe there is the "beetle type" and the "beetle buyer," most people are buyers..the beetle types you find on this forum with 5+ green dots! :)

pdoel

03-01-2006, 02:28 PM

Guess they want to concentrate on the updated GTI.

If the Beetle is eventually discontinued, or they decide to just leave it on this platform, it would have absolutely nothing to do with the GTI.

SMG

03-08-2006, 01:44 AM

..the beetle types you find on this forum with 5+ green dots! :)

That is absolutely not true, I'm a Beetle type, just too much of a dick to have 5 dots. :D

SMG

Sgt Beavis

03-12-2006, 02:10 PM

I can't see how VW can justify keeping the car beyond 2008. It is a great car but I don't see VW putting the money into a complete redesign.

However the Retro fad isn't over and isn't a total failure. The Beetle, of course, has enjoyed resonably good sales. The PT Cruiser is a top seller at DCX. The Thunderbird had only one major flaw, it was overpriced. However the Mustang has clearly illustrated that retro, when done right, is very much in demand. That is why we're about to get the new Challenger and Camero.

Tommy

03-12-2006, 03:07 PM

I have heard via a good friend who has good connections at VW Wolfsburg, that the production of the NB will end indeed around 2008.

The ragster will for 99% not be produced. That was only a prototype.

They will however end with a very special limited edition, maybe with some ragster influences...

They can not keep on updating and re-designing a retro car.

Maybe in 10 years time again orso... :cool:

beetleboygls

03-12-2006, 08:52 PM

i knew i shoulda kept this car stock

SMG

03-13-2006, 03:35 AM

The New Beetle has to die.

A 10-year run of a car that hasn't changed hardly a thing is too long.

They change the Golfs and Jettas every 6 or 7 years. The Beetle is on it's 8th year and is just getting old. A facelift is not the same as an upgrade.

Oyveychris

03-13-2006, 03:57 AM

The original ran for 60 plus years, but I agree, unless it evolves, it's a goner.....

mentalVdub

03-13-2006, 07:23 PM

:lol:

it's the "death to the new beetle" thread! :shoot:

if the new beetle goes, i won't be sad. that special nastolgia that the 98-2000s had is practically gone.

the early years of seeing a modded new beetle was crazy. now it's like, "oh, another modded NB." it's sorta taken on like the PT Cruiser. you always see silly little mods done to those damn things. i see the new beetle turning into that. i guess, in a sense, to me it's just not as cool anymore.

and when new beetles are put up for show, they just aren't taken serriously anymore as they would have been in the early years. omg! i'm rambling on about missed nastolgia. :(

it has ran its course and it needs to be ended.

sherylann

03-15-2006, 06:38 PM

I am a new member and am here because I have a 2000 Vapor Beetle and love my car. I would be sad to see this fun little car leave the marketplace. I planned on driving one forever.:confused:

Tommy

03-17-2006, 10:36 PM

However, even almost reaching the age of 10, you wouldn't give him that age....

He still makes people turn their heads, make people smile, coming closer to have a look at that neat interiour when you parked...

What other car does better? :cool:

Concept1

03-18-2006, 08:56 PM

If it's still selling well I don't see any reason why they would discontinue it. In fact, every time I see a VW sales report the New Beetles are outselling the Golfs and that includes the GTI and R32.

Dorado

03-19-2006, 02:52 AM

The NB is the face of the brand in the US. Here they sell more NB hartops and convertibles combined than they do Golf+GTI. NB's bring into the store people who do not currently own a VW.

And don't worry about needy souls: NB's that are bought new by people who buy cars hoping to catch the latest fad to try to raise their self esteem, those eventually are resold to people who dream of VW and beetles and will take good care of them.:)

SMG

03-30-2006, 05:18 AM

Here they sell more NB hartops and convertibles combined than they do Golf+GTI.

Nope, they actually don't my friend, not anywhere.

moofpup

03-30-2006, 02:40 PM

If you look at the January 06 numbers they do sell more Beetles then all the golf models combined. He didn't say Jettas he said all golf models and thats true.

Total New Beetle 2,236

Golf/GTI/R32 1,035

SMG

03-30-2006, 02:45 PM

Oh, a specific month's numbers.

On average, I don't think Beetles outsell the Golf models.

gilligan

03-31-2006, 12:40 AM

I wonder if because there are so many on the roads again, if little kids still play "my slug bug?" I hated the game because I was the littlest in a car with five kids in it, My arm still hurts.:D :D

manoverboard987

03-31-2006, 12:57 AM

I wonder if because there are so many on the roads again, if little kids still play "my slug bug?" I hated the game because I was the littlest in a car with five kids in it, My arm still hurts.:D :D

my family still does.

TommyK8

03-31-2006, 01:03 AM

Oh, a specific month's numbers.

On average, I don't think Beetles outsell the Golf models.
For the year 2005, there were 36,339 New Beetles sold in the United States. In 2005, there were 15,690 Golf/GTI/R32's sold. New Beetles outsold Golfs in 2005 by more than 2 to 1.

To place NB sales in context, VW sold 104,063 Jettas, 49,233 Passats, and 18,050 Touregs in the United States in 2005.

d_merry

03-31-2006, 04:20 AM

I'm so suprised at how many people are eager to see the new beetle die. I may not have 5+ squares, but I doubt there are many people on here that are nearly as passionate about these cars than I am. When I was born (I'm only 20 just so everyone knows) I was brought home in a light blue 1973 Volkswagen beetle. Since then I've been obsessed. My first car that I bought myself was a 1961 VW Bug. I put thousands into it by money that I saved from my jobs and odd chores for neighbors. I sold it and got a 2000 silver New Beetle GLS. Now I have a 2006 Gecko Green New Beetle. I Hate every other car on the market...not even VW has an attractive car anymore. I was planning on driving beetles forever. It is sad and pathetic that you can't just go up to a beetle drvier and talk, it's wrong, but today I ran into someone with a beetle at a true value and we talked for an hour! VW owes ALL it's success to the first beetle (which was introduced as the split window in 1949) and was sold in the US until 1985 (only as the Karmann convertible though for the last few years). Hell, it was still being made in south america until recently and now after 10 years we're saying it's outdated? It's the same basic design as the orginal!! The world isn't the same place though and people don't like it because it's not the most current or amazing thing ever...but come on...I joined this site because I LOVE THIS CAR...but so many people seem to either not be passionate about it or start fights over stupid things. The one thing I look forward to the most when I get home is logging on to this site and being with people that share my interest...but it breaks my heart to hear people want this car to die or get on just to cause conflict...I don't know...maybe I'm TOO emotional about these "machines" :(

kcfoxie

03-31-2006, 04:45 AM

d_merry - you're not too emotional; you're the type of driver I wish I ran into more often. The primary reason so many want the car to be discontinued is so that only the true enthusiasts will continue to have them. As it stands, models with warranties = the snotty girls will still want to drive them. When they have no warranty and are all used cars, they want them cause they're unfashionable. Sorry, that was a little mean :( But, only a true believer keeps a car that's year (or miles) out of warranty and will cope with oil burning, etc. Do you kinda get what I mean?

manoverboard987

03-31-2006, 02:23 PM

in line with what kc_foxie said, my biggest reason for wanting the new beetle to die is that it has become just another car for so many people.

take for example the countless girls driving new beetles here on FSU campus. (there's only 2 new beetles that i've ever seen here owned by guys - mine and a Techno Blue with some sick BBS rims which every time i see i'm out of newbeetle.org tags. put it this way - we both have the NB bug.) while there are a good number of girls who also have the NB bug (theres a good few college girls on the org who get it), and take great care of their cars, the vast majority buy it just for it's cute face or because it's a trend. it's examples of the latter that i see everyday, sitting in the parking lots with their front grill trim either broken and hanging ot missing, covered in dirt and pollen, tires that have gone flat and burnt out or missing lights. on the roads, they throw them around; hitting curbs, slamming on the gas then slamming on the brakes, letting the black smoke pour out of the tailpipe, or generally not caring about the car. (while some of this can be attributed to obvious lack of driving skill, the rest goes to neglegence and apathy.)

basically, i'd rather the NB not be in production than fall into the hands of people like that. the NB is such a special car with special meaning and purpose, that it saddens me to see it cast asunder by so many.

therefore, it is indeed out of emotion and passion that i say let the new beetle die.

Sky

03-31-2006, 02:33 PM

The business leader of Volkswagen AG, Dr. Pischetsrieder, give an exclusive interview with the magazine "L'Auto-journal" in France. Some words are concerning the New Beetle 2.

Dr. Bernd P.: "A some rare exceptions, the retro style does not generate succes. And still this one is limited to some exceptions, I will quote the Mini, the 911 and... Beetle. About her, she will know a descent. As for the Minibuses, there will not exist in this form, we will produce a vehicle in collaboration with Chrysler and exclusively intended for the American market. Of an identical format, it will be less expensive to manufacture than the Minibus: a requirement imposed for questions of profitability and also because this market does not offer any more same the hopes of volume that five years ago.

So it's officially confirmed ! New Beetle will have a descent in the years to come, information confirmed by Bernd Pischetsrieder, the owner of the group VW.

Source: Forum-newbeetle.com (http://www.forum-newbeetle.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2377)

kcfoxie

03-31-2006, 03:10 PM

Interesting. I wonder if it'll be the Beetle SUV (since those DO sell well here.. SUVs, that is).

SMG

03-31-2006, 05:37 PM

Interesting. I wonder if it'll be the Beetle SUV (since those DO sell well here.. SUVs, that is).

That monstrosity was created by EDAG, and if you need a reminder of how ******* ugly it was, then here ;)

http://www.autoblog.com/media/2006/03/Edag-Biwak-front-3-4-resized.jpg

As for seeing NB's being driven by people who don't care, I am totally feeling the same way. Im not sure if it's just that I notice it happening to NB's more, but it seems like I see more abused Bugs than most cars. Ones that have just been to hell and back, driven by people who honestly don't care. I saw a NB parked at my university in a spot where the parking spot's front ended and quickly became a hill, and the NB's nose was FACEPLANTED INTO the friggin hill. I wanted to cry since I am sure there was damage. It was brand new (I'm guessing certified used) in the fall when I started school, and it has been awful to have to watch that NB decline.. :(

SMG

Steinola

03-31-2006, 05:44 PM

So it's officially confirmed ! New Beetle will have a descent in the years to come, information confirmed by Bernd Pischetsrieder, the owner of the group VW.
Except that... Pischetsrieder was also the one that "officially confirmed" that VW would build the Microbus back in 2003... even going so far as to personally promise that it would be built in the Hanover plant in Ohio... I believe they even signed an agreement with the plant, if memory serves. Things don't happen until they happen. And business decisions change all the time. The NB2 won't be "officially confirmed" until it actually hits the streets.

kcfoxie

03-31-2006, 07:00 PM

And it could be Ragster or a VW_embled and sold EDAG unit. Remember, the convertibles are all actualy KARMANN cars that are sold as VWs (that's still the case today right? It was back in the olden days at least). Who knows... I bet we DO get a Microbus looking Chrysler-powered minivan with a Westfallia edition (I HOPE I HOPE I HOPE)!!

Steinola

03-31-2006, 07:35 PM

Remember, the convertibles are all actualy KARMANN cars that are sold as VWs (that's still the case today right? It was back in the olden days at least).
Wellllll... sort of. My understanding is that Karmann just produces the roof components. They don't actually build the car anymore. They produced the entire original Beetle convertible, and the entire Golf-styled Cabriolet... but for the NBC, they just provide the roof. VW still assembles it themselves.

But I'm not sure what that has to do with anything. Whether Karmann or EDAG or any other vendor actually constructed the car, VW would still present it as a VW product. Karmann does, afterall, produce the entire Chrysler Crossfire and Audi A4 'vert... and you never hear about it.

We'll most likely never get anything from VW that looks like the Microbus concept. They've already said that it was the styling itself that made it too much of a risk for the US market. But, you're right, hopefully we'll see a Westy that has some of the styling cues (probably toned down quite a lot).

kcfoxie

03-31-2006, 08:36 PM

wow I didn't know about the crossfire or A4 convertible.. how cool.

I'm gonna bet they make a Westy. What is a VW van without the poptop? Then again, Chrysler is involved....

Concept1

04-03-2006, 12:10 AM

So it's officially confirmed ! New Beetle will have a descent in the years to come, information confirmed by Bernd Pischetsrieder, the owner of the group VW.

Are you sure that's what he said? Descent? That was clearly taken from a computer-based German to English translation. Maybe he said descendant. He mentions the 911 and Mini as well and both of them had descendants. There was talk of a next generation Beetle based on the Polo platform, one more closely following the "people's car" ideal.

Sky

04-03-2006, 06:27 PM

Are you sure that's what he said? Descent? That was clearly taken from a computer-based German to English translation. Maybe he said descendant. He mentions the 911 and Mini as well and both of them had descendants. There was talk of a next generation Beetle based on the Polo platform, one more closely following the "people's car" ideal.

Yes, of course, Bernd Pischetsrieder said "descendant". So the next generation of Beetle is envisaged by VW. It is official ! ;)

Here the French article, from "L'Auto-Journal" (March 30th, 2006 ):

Dr. Bernd P. : "A quelques rare exceptions, le style rétro n'engendre pas le succés. Et encore celui-ci se limite-t-il à quelques niches, je citerai la Mini, la 911 et... la Beetle.
Au sujet de cette dernière, elle connaîtra une descendance. Quant au Minibus, il n'existera pas sous cette forme, nous allons produire un véhicule en collaboration avec Chrysler et exclusivement destiné au marché américain. D'un format identique, il coûtera moins cher à fabriquer que le Minibus : une exigence imposée pour des questions de rentabilité et aussi parce que ce marché n'offre plus les même espérances de volume qu'il y a cinq ans.

Excuse me for my bad english ! I use Google Language Tools. :o

Steinola

04-03-2006, 08:33 PM

It is official ! ;)

I still say it means absolutely nothing. The president of VW casually dropping a one sentence aside in the context of the larger interview proves nothing. It doesn't comfirm (nor, admittedly deny) that there will be a NB2. Like I said... it won't be "official" until tires hit the street... if they ever do.

By the way... what was with that NB "WB" April Fool's joke, anywho. It won't let me read that post.

bluebeetlebabe

06-05-2006, 12:46 AM

aww I dont want the NB to go!!!:( yes I am a 22 year old girl but I take pride in my NB and I love it alot and take great car of it!! I hope that it doesnt go but I do like the concept of the Beetle SUV;)

SMG

06-05-2006, 12:56 AM

but I do like the concept of the Beetle SUV;)

GAG! :barfkiss:

CoriBug

06-05-2006, 02:43 AM

That SUV thing is UGLY!! The Beetle is special, it should only be Old and New, not turned into THAT!

I'm 21 and love my buggy, but I see your point about girls not giving a rat's behind about their NB. Most of the drivers that snub me when I wave or smile are my age or younger. Although I did get a very friendly smile from a girl in a white bug last week. She actually looked nice! A lot of kids I babysit for play slug bug. One family has 2 girls and a boy. The girls say "HerbieCorislugbug" and their brother says "CoriCar" when they see an old or new Beetle. It's pretty funny. The boy is 2 and he loves to sit in the back and pretend he's going somewhere.

Whether the Beetle continues for another 2 years or another 15, it will always be remembered by the people who loved it best.

Cori

bluebeetlebabe

06-05-2006, 05:24 PM

I never have snubed anyone! I actually wave at everyone in a Beetle! 9-10 they dont wave back:( so Im not in your statistics of mean girls in Bugs!

Atomic Glee

06-05-2006, 06:17 PM

Take my info however you wish, but from what I've seen VW is, in fact, working on a new New Beetle successor for the 2009 model year. This isn't a confirmation that it's a done deal, but it is being talked about and/or worked on. This is the information I've been given on the subject:

New New Beetle:
SOP: July 2009
MI: Oct. 2009
Convertible one year later.
Could be more agressively priced than current car.
Maybe $15,000.
Volume: 25k sedan, 25k convertible.

"SOP" is Start Of Production, "MI" is Market Introduction. "Volume" refers to the projected per-year sales figures VW is aiming for.

dnyed

06-05-2006, 06:55 PM

Interesting. I hope it's not too different. I kinda like that most look the same. Our GTGs are fun, because we are all the "same". Not like the Mitsubishi Eclipse GTG we saw on one of our Mount St. Helens GTGs. Yes, they were all Eclipses, but there were numerous styles. We were cooler....... ;)

CoriBug

06-06-2006, 06:01 AM

I never have snubed anyone! I actually wave at everyone in a Beetle! 9-10 they dont wave back:( so Im not in your statistics of mean girls in Bugs!

I didn't say all girls in Bugs are mean or that you are. heck I am a girl! And Ashley(vdubbugman53's girlfriend is a Beetlemaniac)went to TNBRU with us. I'm just saying that a lot of girls who have bugs don't appreciate them like us orgers do. I get snubbed by a lot of older drivers too. But most of the Bugs I've seen that are horribly mistreated are driven by girls who couldn't care less. I don't get it. :confused: I start to say 'Cool car' or something, and they ignore me or look at me weird. It's like some sort of a clique exists. Oh well. I'll keep waving and I don't really care what other people think. :D

Cori

jerryn

06-07-2006, 06:37 PM

It would be smarter if there is a demand for the car to keep it in production. I was suprised when the NB is only available with the 5cylinder engine now. I really like my 1.8T, the car is damn fast! My new commute to work is going to get me in trouble. I work in Hyannis, MA It's @ 61miles each way. My best time home is currently 40 minutes. I know it's time to
slow down now. But, man... Rte 28 is going to get me in trouble.
Over 130mph on Rte 28. And when I am pushing the car hard I still get at least 28mpg! When I average 65mph I get 30mpg.
That's an average of 91.5MPG, in reality that's 45mph-135mph
I would like to see wider vw bug, kind of porche looking.
Also an awd version. Have you ever worked on your beetle yourself? If you have you'd realize there's no way to turn the bug into a hybrid, no room. An ethanol/dual fuel vehicle would be cool though.

dunno513

06-08-2006, 02:49 AM

With a 120 mile commute:eek: you need a TDI.

Check out this page and look at the RSi edition specs.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VW_Beetle_RSi#The_New_Beetle_RSi

New Beetle RSi... :bowdown: :firedevil

SMG

06-09-2006, 06:20 AM

I would like to see wider vw bug, kind of porche looking.

Umm, the NB doesn't need to get wider. It needs to get smaller, if anything. ;)

I hope they make a NNB, I'd sell a liver and buy the very first one. :D

SMG

niki

06-09-2006, 09:34 AM

When this car came out in 98 I was obsessed. I always wanted one. I am the typical college girl (22) who is "trendy." But that does not mean I don't absolutely loooove my car. I stare at it when it's sitting outside of a restaurant window. I purposley will drive slower on the freeway so I can stare at the bug next to me for a minute.

I have always wanted to wave to people, but whenever I smile or look over there, they never look back. I thought I was odd until I met my new family her eon the org. I hate when I see bugs without flowers in their bud vases. My step-mom says my calling in life should be that I leave little flowers underneath people's windshield wiper's! But alas, it would prbably be some bitchy college girl who would think I was a freak because I care about my car (and her's!).

I intended to drive a New Beetle for a very long time and don't think I could ever get rid of Bugzzi, even if it was to get a newer one. I hope this is simply talk... but I know I am wishfully thinking... :(

niki

06-09-2006, 09:36 AM

i'm out of newbeetle.org tags.

What are these tags you speak of? I need some to spread the word!! :D

Chubs763

06-09-2006, 09:26 PM

Bring back the type 82!!!

or the schwimmwagen.

Concept1

06-09-2006, 09:53 PM

Umm, the NB doesn't need to get wider. It needs to get smaller, if anything. ;)

I can't fit in the back seat as it is.

dunno513

06-11-2006, 07:43 PM

I can't fit in the back seat as it is.

These things have a back seat ? :D

nicandlance

07-04-2006, 01:50 AM

I tend to think that there will always be someone who wants a new beetle.... I would be sad to see them go too.:(

I don't see the need to facelift them year after year - they ARE
after all, a retro car. A new beetle always looks fresh. Updating colours from year to year and putting more effort into reliability, ride and features would be a better option (personal opinion only of course).

tdi jerry

07-05-2006, 01:57 AM

the dealer's sell the new beetle as fast as they can get them.the nb tdi the dealer can't get them fast enough.so i don't see why vw would stop selling them in the usa. :D

jedimacfan

07-31-2006, 04:58 AM

kcfoxie

07-31-2006, 06:20 AM

People have been predicting and worrying over the demise of Apple Computer, too, and look what's happening. Their marketshare is increasing. So, obviously, what VW needs to do to the New Beetle is switch out the 4 and 5 cylinder engines for an Intel Core Duo processor.:ha:
Your analogy isn't too far from correct, only instead of a 4 or 5 cyl engine, they need a diesel hybrid and a gasoline hybrid. They should produce more diesel hybrids than gas, and tote a 70+MPG rating CITY and that will get everyone back into a bug, no matter the cost, cause in the USA you get a TAX CREDIT for owning a hybrid *of any type* and we all know diesel is cleaner burning than gasoline anyhow... also, trivia, concept 1 was shown as a hardtop and cabriolet in a hybrid 3cyl diesel that got over 60mpg. it's just a matter of time, right?

mentalVdub

07-31-2006, 09:52 AM

Your analogy isn't too far from correct, only instead of a 4 or 5 cyl engine, they need a diesel hybrid and a gasoline hybrid. They should produce more diesel hybrids than gas, and tote a 70+MPG rating CITY and that will get everyone back into a bug, no matter the cost, cause in the USA you get a TAX CREDIT for owning a hybrid *of any type* and we all know diesel is cleaner burning than gasoline anyhow... also, trivia, concept 1 was shown as a hardtop and cabriolet in a hybrid 3cyl diesel that got over 60mpg. it's just a matter of time, right?

when pigs fly...

vw won't do that anytime soon.
i'm not even sure they can build a mass produced hybrid that's worth a darn.

pdoel

07-31-2006, 02:19 PM

Motor Trends had a little article about the new models VW will be offering in the next few years. No real specifics, but it did say they are definitely working on the next gen New Beetle. It said the current model will continue till at least 2010 unchanged.

It also said that around 2009, they will offer a new entry level car. They mentioned the Polo, but said that with VW's recent return to old names, they wouldn't be surprised to see it called the Fox.

FineExampl

07-31-2006, 02:29 PM

It also said that around 2009, they will offer a new entry level car. They mentioned the Polo, but said that with VW's recent return to old names, they wouldn't be surprised to see it called the Fox.That's sort of confusing. I thought they renamed the Lupo to the old Fox name in Europe? I saw the pics already of the new Fox somewhere online. No idea where i saw them though. It looked kinda cool though.

Regardless, i'm gladd we'll have NBs until at least 2010. That sounds very good. :D

kcfoxie

07-31-2006, 02:45 PM

when pigs fly...

vw won't do that anytime soon.
i'm not even sure they can build a mass produced hybrid that's worth a darn.
Ah, how I love it when you chime in Amanda :)

Their 3cyl turbo diesel, which I think can be found already in the Polo/Fox, gets 60MPG as it stands. They can license the Honda 30HP motor (or reverse engineer this/license the technology idea and use a german electric motor) to assist it, or more like Toyota, not kick on the diesel till you slam the pedal/reach 20MPH... and volia immediate 70MPG city car. Not impossible, and I think that since VW was the first to announce a hybrid concept car (in 1994) that they're going to dent their competition sales... especially since Toyota owners don't get the full tax credit anymore.. only Honda and Ford owners. That's three companies, I can bet VW will be the first german hybrid maker.

mentalVdub

07-31-2006, 08:57 PM

Ah, how I love it when you chime in Amanda :)

Their 3cyl turbo diesel, which I think can be found already in the Polo/Fox, gets 60MPG as it stands. They can license the Honda 30HP motor (or reverse engineer this/license the technology idea and use a german electric motor) to assist it, or more like Toyota, not kick on the diesel till you slam the pedal/reach 20MPH... and volia immediate 70MPG city car. Not impossible, and I think that since VW was the first to announce a hybrid concept car (in 1994) that they're going to dent their competition sales... especially since Toyota owners don't get the full tax credit anymore.. only Honda and Ford owners. That's three companies, I can bet VW will be the first german hybrid maker.

so vw is the first to make a hybrid concept in 94, huh?

where is it!?!?!?
why isn't in production!?!?!
why does volkswagen lag???

even if they were to make this illusive hybrid engine, it's not like it will come out to the states... or at least anytime soon.

when pigs fly.

mentalVdub

07-31-2006, 09:36 PM

doood... the more i think about your comment on vw making the first hybrid in 94, the more i realise and notice a bit of your ignorancy.

just for the heck of it and a bit of education...

"In 1898 Ferdinand Porsche designed the Lohner-Porsche carriage, a series-hybrid vehicle that used a one-cylinder gasoline internal combustion engine that spun a generator which powered four wheel-mounted electric motors. The car was presented at the 1900 World Exhibition in Paris. The up to 56 km/h (35 mph) fast carriage broke several Austrian speed records, and also won the Exelberg Rally in 1901 with Porsche himself driving. Over 300 of the Lohner-Porsche carriages were sold to the public.

In 1959 the development of the first transistor-based electric car - the Henney Kilowatt - heralded the development of the electronic speed control that paved the way for modern hybrid electric cars. The Henney Kilowatt was the first modern production electric vehicle and was developed by a cooperative effort between National Union Electric Company, Henney Coachworks, Renault, and the Eureka Williams Company. Although sales of the Kilowatt were dismal, the development of the Kilowatt served was a historical "who's who" of electric propulsion technology.

A more recent working prototype of the electric-hybrid vehicle was built by Victor Wouk (one of the scientists involved with the Henney Kilowatt and also brother of author Herman Wouk ). Wouk's work with electric hybrid vehicles in the 1960s and 1970s earned the title as the "Godfather of the Hybrid"[2]). Wouk installed a prototype electric-hybrid drivetrain into a 1972 Buick Skylark provided by GM for the 1970 Federal Clean Car Incentive Program, but the program was killed by the EPA in 1976. Since then, hobbyists have continued to build hybrids but none was put into mass production by a major manufacturer until the waning years of the twentieth century.

The regenerative-braking hybrid, the core design concept of most production hybrids, was developed by Electrical Engineer David Arthurs around 1978 using off-the shelf components and an Opel GT. However the voltage controller to link the batteries, motor (a jet-engine starter motor), and DC generator was Mr. Arthurs'. The vehicle exhibited ~75 mpg fuel efficiency and plans for it (as well as somewhat updated versions) are still available through the Mother Earth News web site. The Mother Earth News' own 1980 version claimed nearly 84 mpg."

that's just a little bit... i'll find more for you.

Whitacre

07-31-2006, 09:40 PM

Schooled! Woo!

kcfoxie

07-31-2006, 09:42 PM

Like apple did with iPod compared to Creative and Rio, VW has the upper hand in delaying their own product. Let Toyota, Honda and Ford try and fail and eat up their tax credits. VW will bring out a radically different hybrid, that's more efficient, with a very hard messaged ad campagne (like the Honda Insight ad was), and it will sell like mad. For two reasons: better economy, it's diesel (biodiesel toted as being compatible and preffered to have 0 emissions) and because it'll still be elligable for the tax credit (assuming it rolls out before 2011). I think we're a lot closer to seeing a VW hybrid than you think.

kcfoxie

07-31-2006, 09:46 PM

Um, Porsche basically = VW, to start with. Regardless, it was GERMANS who came up with it. With Porsche taking high stakes in Audi-VW, it's simply a matter of time. That's all it is.

Consider this: If the man who invented Beetle came up with a hybrid design in 1898, then it makes even more sense that the rebirth of his car was a hybrid. Germans have been in love with diesel for ages, and have considered it the better fuel. I am confident VW will product a Diesel-Electric hybrid before they produce a Gas-Electric model, even if the D-E does not comes to the US at first. Find me data that shows how long Toyota has been working on it, then we have something to talk about.

kcfoxie

07-31-2006, 09:57 PM

from hybridcars.com:

1976
U.S. Congress enacted Public Law 94-413, the Electric and Hybrid Vehicle Research, Development, and Demonstration Act of 1976. Among the law’s objectives were to work with industry to improve batteries, motors, controllers and other hybrid-electric components.

General Electric was chosen to construct a parallel-hybrid sedan, and Toyota built its first hybrid—a small sports car with a gas-turbine generator supplying current to an electric motor.

So the germans (ie founding father of VW) started out in 1898, Toyota started in 1978. HM. Again, I think the VW product will be better. I don't remember seeing/hearing anything of a hybrid from any of the makers in the 90s, and please correct me if I am wrong.

This website states (VW%29%20started%20out%20in%201898,%20Toyota%20sta rted%20in%201978.%20HM.%20Again,%20I%20think%20the %20VW%20product%20will%20be%20better.%20I%20don%27 t%20remember%20seeing/hearing%20anything%20of%20a%20hybrid%20from%20any% 20of%20the%20maker) that in 2005, the 2007 Jetta would be a 5-seater mild hybrid but had not commited to releasing it.

Again, show me 1980s and 1990s concept cars from the Japanese that even hinted at Hybrid technology, cause I'm not finding anything on my own.