Thinking about a remote starter......

[Grandpa]

I'd like to install a remote starter for my wife, has anyone had any experience with these on a NB? There's a few old threads on this subject, but would love to hear from someone who's got one installed and what they think of theirs....I seriously doubt I'll install this myself, was mainly interested in how they do/do not perform, and who should install it. I don't think most dealers will do this. Also-it needs to work from about 100 feet away.....

[Grandpa]

Well. I think I figured out why there's no replies-I stopped in Ziebart today to talk to them about this. They said they don't do NB's, or Vdubs in general. They tried to install one on a NB this morning, spent hours w/it, couldn't get anywhere. I'm thinking this could be scary, I may have to scrap this idea....There's one other place I know of in the area that does this (it's a car audio place), but it looks like the smart money would be stay away from them...

[FarrisK]

I surpised that there were no responses to this.

I think the reason they won't do it is because of the immobilizer chip. If the chip is not near the ECU, the car won't start (actually it won't keep running)

I suppose you could mount the immobilizer chip from your key in the car... but if someone were to get in your car, it would be really easy for them to hotwire it.

[flip240]

http://www.the12volt.com/installbay/...olkswagen.html

I just installed a Viper 791xv alarm/remote start into my mom's 99 Camry v6. I used the info from this website. It really wasn't difficult per-say, and I think what most shops fear about Volkswagens is the fact that they (German cars) are put together in a different manner than most Japanese/American cars are, so they are afraid of breaking interior pieces. If you find someone who's more comfortable with German cars, I don't think they'll have an issue with it.

Originally Posted by FarrisK

I surpised that there were no responses to this.

I think the reason they won't do it is because of the immobilizer chip. If the chip is not near the ECU, the car won't start (actually it won't keep running)

I suppose you could mount the immobilizer chip from your key in the car... but if someone were to get in your car, it would be really easy for them to hotwire it.

Immobilizer chips have been around on most cars (GM's especially) since the 90's, so it's not a new technology. Many remote start manufacturers such as DEI (Makes Viper/Clifford) sell a separate module to get around some (if not most) immobilizer systems for remote starts.

[SMG]

What's the point? Warming your car up for more than 30 seconds is a waste. Anything after that isn't helping the car so just suck it up and be cold for a minute or two in the morning.

[miffmole]

Originally Posted by SMG

What's the point? Warming your car up for more than 30 seconds is a waste.

Plus, the oil doesn't really circulate properly until you get the car moving. The top part of the engine on a cold engine is fairly dry even after starting.

[mspastrygurl]

I dont think it can be done. I called the dealer and they said it could be done but they dont recommend it cause of it messing up the car or something. I'm acutally thinking about inquiring about it again, so if I get any new info I'll let ya know

[flip240]

Originally Posted by mspastrygurl

I dont think it can be done. I called the dealer and they said it could be done but they dont recommend it cause of it messing up the car or something. I'm acutally thinking about inquiring about it again, so if I get any new info I'll let ya know

Of course they will tell you that, because they don't want to deal with that when you bring it in to be serviced (should something go wrong that is directly or indirectly related to the alarm system; especially on VW's that have enough electrical problems as it is).

Whatever time it takes for you to press the remote start and be ready to jump in your car is the time you're saving by getting one. Some people don't have the time to wait 30 seconds for the oil to begin pressurizing/circulating throughout the engine. My mom finds it an enormous convenience having it because once she gets it all set, she can set her car in drive and go. Our beetle won't need one because we aren't in a hurry all the time, nor will my Nissan (which actually requires a prolonged idle to warm up the forged pistons). But if you want it and think it's worth it, I don't see why not.

[newbuggertwo]

............. are good. Getting an engine up to temp before driving is a good thing, especially in winter when its cold. Leave the heater on when you leave the car and you have a warm car and seats if they are heated.

It also helps in summer when you can get into a nice cool car on a hot day. I can't disagree more with the person that said 30 seconds is all you need to warm an engine. Depending on the outside temp it may take five minutes to get the oil and coolant to proper temp. Idling doesn't load the engine during warm up like driving it where it is under much more of a load.

Remote starters should only be installed by a very good 12V specialist with experience on VW's. There aren't many competent shops like this. Usually they are an old school stereo/security shop that has been around a long time. Around me I have the choice of going to a place with three guys with over 20 years experience or a place with three guys that are around 20 years old. Most people don't have this choice.

ET

[miffmole]

Originally Posted by newbuggertwo

............. are good. Getting an engine up to temp before driving is a good thing, especially in winter when its cold. Leave the heater on when you leave the car and you have a warm car and seats if they are heated.

It also helps in summer when you can get into a nice cool car on a hot day. I can't disagree more with the person that said 30 seconds is all you need to warm an engine. Depending on the outside temp it may take five minutes to get the oil and coolant to proper temp. Idling doesn't load the engine during warm up like driving it where it is under much more of a load.

Remote starters should only be installed by a very good 12V specialist with experience on VW's. There aren't many competent shops like this. Usually they are an old school stereo/security shop that has been around a long time. Around me I have the choice of going to a place with three guys with over 20 years experience or a place with three guys that are around 20 years old. Most people don't have this choice.

ET

All of that is great, but the top of your engine will not be properly lubricated just sitting still...Plus, an idling car gets 0 MPG.
I always go right after starting, regardless of the temperature. My last car had 268,000 miles and was still running well when I traded it, btw.

[LadybugEwa]

The idea is, you warm the engine for 30 seconds until the idle comes down to 'normal' and then you drive it gently until the blue temp light turns off.
This is going by the owner's manual.
I agree that it's comfortable getting into a warmed/cooled car, but what's comfortable for you isn't what's best for the engine.
Once you start driving, the temperature equalizes really fast too.

[raemhild]

I'll be getting one for a few reasons. Regardless of engine wear, which I'm sure is everyone's top priority, it's just a cool modification.

Please let us know what you find out.

[Outnumbered]

On topic, I was sitting in the white marsh mail parking lot last week and a woman got into a (new) GTI sitting beside me. But a good 3 to 5 minutes before that, the car just started up on its own. Scared the crap out of me. So, I had to ask. And she said that the dealer installed the auto start when she bought the car. Not sure of the dealer. Just know what I seen and what she said.

Off topic, My TDI will take up to 5 minutes to warm up to a OK drivable temperature. Even in the dead of summer it may take 2 minutes. If I'm seeing good oil pressure on the gauge. That is plugged into the oil pressure passage. Then the cylinder head is getting good oil pressure. And that is 2 seconds after firing it up. BTW, my car has 200,000 on it. With the bare minimum in maintenance done to it(I even go 10K on oil changes). And if I don't see 500,000 on this little thing. I'm going to be upset.

If your not getting good oil pressure everywhere in the engine, in 5 to 10 seconds. There is a problem. You got a bad oil pump, or you are running bad or the wrong oil.

[boogety boogety]

From the convenience standpoint (warm car when you enter), remote starters are good. But...

One suggestion: If you want a warm seat with a minimum of hassle, get yourself one of those seat massager/heated seat combos at a Bed Bath and Beyond-type store, plug it into your cig lighter, and fire the sucker up the moment you get in the car...

From a wear-and-tear standpoint, the engine doesn't care one whit whether the car is idling or moving, all parts needing lubrication will be lubricated as needed, so remote starters are neutral. Witness every cop car idling at an accident, every limo at a funeral, every fire marshall's car at a fire, they all sit there idling and no harm comes to the car's mechanicals.

From an emissions standpoint, remote starters help you put more emissions and pollutants into the atmosphere. From this perspective, remote starters are not ecologically friendly. And there's always the idiot that uses one in his or her garage and carbon-monoxides the entire household to Kingdom Come... Plus, you're wasting gas. Sure, you're not paying $4 a gallon right now, but trust me... you will again, and probably sooner than most people think...

All modern car manufacturers simply suggest to start your car, put it in gear, and drive away normally, until the engine reaches operating temperature (then you can do those crowd-pleasing burnouts or cut donuts in empty parking lots if you want). The days of carburated engines needing to be warmed up for optimum operation went away with Chevettes and their ilk... all contemporary fuel-injected engines are computer-controlled for best fuel mixtures in any climate.

Now, having said all that... if you do want a remote starter, they can be installed by any competent alarm and stereo installer. How do you know they're competent? Easy... If they say they can't do it on a VW, they're not. I don't know if you have Earmark Car Audios in your area, but here in Texas, they can do it. Google... or ask around, it can be done, you just have to find one that will install it for you...

Me? I'd just as soon start my car and flick on the seat warmer... mostly, I just avoid the whole mess by not driving my 'vert when it's cold...

[miffmole]

Originally Posted by boogety boogety

From the convenience standpoint (warm car when you enter), remote starters are good. But...

From a wear-and-tear standpoint, the engine doesn't care one whit whether the car is idling or moving, all parts needing lubrication will be lubricated as needed, so remote starters are neutral. Witness every cop car idling at an accident, every limo at a funeral, every fire marshall's car at a fire, they all sit there idling and no harm comes to the car's mechanicals.

Each of the above cars have already been driven and warmed up before the aforementioned idling scenarios...unless these crises happened at their homes. Also, which vehicle do you think the above public servants are the most judicious with, their public vehicles, or their own personal vehicles?

http://www.consumerenergycenter.org/myths/idling.html

[SMG]

Originally Posted by raemhild

it's just a cool modification.

After looking at your CarDomain page it made me realize we have completely opposite ideas of "cool".

No sense in arguing anymore, if that's what you feel like spending money on, all the power to ya.

[mark]

i have a remote start on my car 2002 beetle and it works great..i mainly got it as it is also used a a turbo timer..

[raemhild]

Originally Posted by SMG

After looking at your CarDomain page it made me realize we have completely opposite ideas of "cool".

No sense in arguing anymore, if that's what you feel like spending money on, all the power to ya.

No arguments here. I'm jealous of your supercharger.

[boogety boogety]

Each of the above cars have already been driven and warmed up before the aforementioned idling scenarios...unless these crises happened at their homes. Also, which vehicle do you think the above public servants are the most judicious with, their public vehicles, or their own personal vehicles?

http://www.consumerenergycenter.org/myths/idling.html

Well, if it's in the California Energy Commission website, like most everything else online, it must be true:

Myth #2: Idling is good for your engine. Reality: Excessive idling can actually damage your engine components, including cylinders, spark plugs, and exhaust systems. Fuel is only partially combusted when idling because an engine does not operate at its peak temperature. This leads to the build up of fuel residues on cylinder walls that can damage engine components and increase fuel consumption.

Of course, I used to manage a 44-car-and-truck fleet in another life for a number of years, with most of the vehicles allowed to idle (to avoid hassle from parking nazis who would assume the driver would return post haste) during deliveries of documents and other important messages that sometimes required an immediate reply and return, so sometimes the vehicles would idle for fifteen, twenty, thirty minutes or more at a time. Not what I would have preferred, but it was firm company policy and not worth arguing about at the time. Regardless: Never, and I mean never, did we experience any engine failure or damage from this practice, and we would get 150,000 trouble-free miles from our vehicles before mandatory replacement (and the engine in-use timers would show thousands of hours of use!). So I'll go with my own experience, and let the Shaky Side have it's own ideas...

[flip240]

Originally Posted by boogety boogety

Well, if it's in the California Energy Commission website, like most everything else online, it must be true: ...

Yup

Myth #2: Idling is good for your engine. Reality: Excessive idling can actually damage your engine components, including cylinders, spark plugs, and exhaust systems. Fuel is only partially combusted when idling because an engine does not operate at its peak temperature. This leads to the build up of fuel residues on cylinder walls that can damage engine components and increase fuel consumption.

And there's his proof, I've never seen a buildup of carbon deposits on the cylinder walls, the heads/valves/spark plugs yes, not the cylinder walls. California needs to do their research better.

What's the deal if there isn't as high of oil pressure in the engine during idling anyway? The engine isn't under load so no components are under stress, as long as there is enough pressure to keep metal/metal contact from happening, which there is.

Also, if you do idle your car long enough during startup that carbon deposits start to form on the combustion parts, provided you don't baby your car everyday (which is why most soccer mom's etc have the worst luck with gunked oil imo) the heat generated during brisk driving will burn it away.